Why Are Christians So Dogmatic?

by Mike Edwards Okay, I admit more than just Christians are dogmatic. It seems many people, regardless of beliefs, are unable to discuss their different opinions in an open-minded, civil manner. This seems to be the case regardless of the arena – whether it be religion or politics. I am not trying to be judgmental. When younger I fell into the same trap many Christians do because of their view of the Bible. Assuming God inspired the Bible can be a problem One often believes they are speaking for God based on their interpretation of Scriptures. It is assumed God approved everything written about God in the Bible. The problem is God isn’t always portrayed as loving. See here. Anyway, even if we could prove the writers of the Bible always understood God perfectly, the truth is biblical scholars who have a deep respect for Scriptures don’t agree what God believes according to the Bible about many moral values impacting billions of lives – gays, women, unbelievers. A possible uninspired Book doesn’t lead to such problems. A Creator surely loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. Perfect Godly and human love must be the same. A supposed inspired Book must not replace our discussion of common moral sense given to us by our Creator. People demanding or preaching certainty is a problem One pastor I deeply respecter once told me a good leader comes off certain (confident what the Bible says). Yet, they attended seminary where different interpretation of the same biblical passages were explored. The truth is we don’t always know exactly what truth is, according to the Bible, whether it regards the afterlife or other moral issues. Laypeople often find comfort psychologically in certainty rather than uncertainty. Certainty rather than unknowing causes less anxiety. Assume uncertainty if you have one rational friend who believes differently from you whether it’s about religion, science, or politics. It should be intuitive those who reject diverse opinions is unloving and controlling. Most don’t except such behaviors in their personal relationships. Having good intentions by believing you are right for the whole doesn’t matter if you could be wrong. Religious leaders seem hell-bent in telling people what they must believe about God according to their understanding and interpretation of the Bible. Scientists or Politicians who refuse debate of their policies are no different. Assuming to know the greatest good is a problem The best decisions are often those that accomplish the most good for the most people. Making decisions, assuming you know the greater good than others, is playing God (Superior) in the lives of others. Free speech is necessary to allow the battle of ideas when certainty doesn’t exist. A preacher can’t claim God condemns gays because the Bible says so. Many of us don’t believe the Bible says any such thing. See here. Most of us believe except true racists that all humans are created equal, not that one’s skin color determines superiority. Yes, the KKK is allowed to state their hate speech on public platforms. I like my chances of winning that argument in the free market of ideas. I want racists being exposed for their ideas. The only free speech that should be censored is that which encourages others to commit violence toward others. You must peacefully protest. You can’t say “any Jew you see should be killed.” Attitudes to avoid dogmatism If only religious leaders didn’t always claim their biblical interpretation is correct and at least acknowledge literature requires interpretation despite supposed divine intervention. Stop calling one another a heretic or conspiracist that have a different opinion. If we listened to everyone’s opinion civilly and sought to discern together what was the most loving action according to the circumstances. Morality is rooted in human natures, rather than just a product of religion influences. Biblical interpretations that go against our moral intuitions may be wrong. If we only closely guarded one’s freedom to choose when the possibility exist you could be wrong, rather than calling others heretics or conspiracists ******* Mike Edwards was added as a writer and has been a great addition to the site. Mike provides many interesting views and various ways of looking at things. He is not afraid to ask questions and he keeps an open mind as to teachings of the institutional church. Mike also has his own site where he writes at What God May Really Be Like

What Is God’s Love Really Like?

by Mike Edwards I write a lot about this topic as I named my blog over 15 years ago What God May Really Be Like I used the word “May” because I was countering dogmatism growing up in church. Who knows what God is really like unless God talks to you directly? Be humble. But, if you are told something about God that goes against your moral intuitions, question it. Most accept God is love. How do we best determine what God love like There is a problem claiming the Bible is the definitively word on what God’s love is like. Ancient literature is subject to interpretation. Even if the writers understood their God perfectly, which we can’t prove, we can’t claim our interpretations are perfect. The truth is biblical scholars who have a deep respect for the Bible don’t agree what God thinks about gays, women, hell, and other moral issues. See here. See here. See here. Gays are supposedly condemned, women’s leadership roles are limited, despite their gifts and a fiery torturous afterlife awaits infidels – all in God’s name! Why wouldn’t God be most like what our moral intuitions suggest. Our inborn sense of good and evil, not an ancient Book, tells us sexual abuse or murder is immoral. If a Creator exists, it is only intuitive that a Creator loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. We all seem to know the question we ought to ask ourselves – am I loving others perfectly? Or am I loving others like I want to be loved. Many times, when one believes contrary to universal moral intuitions (infidels should be destroyed in this life), it is because of their interpretation of a supposed inspired Book by their God. Surely, perfect human love is the same as Godly love The only God worth believing in must be perfectly loving as opposed to in any way hateful. God’s love surely is the same as supreme parents – other-directed not self-consumed. Love gets excited when we do well and make a difference in the lives of others. Love anticipates, hopes for my success, believes in me, pulls for me even when failing, because I do the same for my children. We doubt God but God still loves. Parents bring children into the world hoping their children freely reciprocate their love for authentic relationships. Why would God be any different. How you imagine God’s love can determine how you relate to others If we think God is hard to please and pissed off about sin rather than what sin is doing to us, we may judge others just as harshly rather than showing patience and mercy If God is really a warlike God according to the OT, we will use such behaviors to possibly justify going to war when we shouldn’t If God condemns gays, we will condemn gays out of devotion to God If God thinks men have authority over women in some positions, that will filter down to your wives, daughters, and friends and stifle their gifts If God can prevent evil and doesn’t, isn’t that like a parent who arbitrarily decides to watch their child being sexually abused or not? Maybe God can’t love perfectly by controlling freedom. God can only stop evil with the help of others or not create freedom! I’m convinced belief in a benevolent God, according to common moral intuitions, makes you kinder. We often treat others the way we think God treats us. How has God’s threats of punishment helped you break away from bad habits or behaviors you long to change? I guess fear God if helps to avoid consequences of destructive actions. But if struggling and need encouragement and mercy, a loving God awaits with open arms. Grace or authoritativeness doesn’t guarantee change, but I believe we best change because of a friend’s or God’s love and acceptance. See It Matters If Your God Is Nurturing Or Authoritative! Mike Edwards was added as a writer and has been a great addition to the site. Mike provides many interesting views and various ways of looking at things. He is not afraid to ask questions and he keeps an open mind as to teachings of the institutional church. Mike also has his own site where he writes at What God May Really Be Like

Forsake Not Assembling Together

by Michael Donahoe

So often, when we talk about church we think of a building we go to once a week. I do not know about you, but the verse in Hebrews 10:25 about not forsaking the assembling of yourselves together sure gets quoted a lot when it comes to church attendance.

Once someone hears my wife and I have stopped attending an organized service each week, the first thing we usually hear is this verse.

Truth of the matter is, I do not think this verse is even talking about what we call church.

As I have stated before, church is not a building or a place. Church is the people of God, those of us born into the Kingdom by grace. Church is not an organization it is an organism. Church is not a one-day event, it is a daily lifestyle of people loving God and loving others.

When reading the verses preceding this verse, you find it is talking about how we are now granted permission to enter into the Holy place, not a building, but into the presence of God. This happened when Jesus died and the veil was torn from top to bottom.

To me, this verse is saying that we need our brothers and sisters in Christ for encouragement and to stimulate one another to love and good deeds in Christ. It has nothing to do with an organized religious service in a building. It has everything to do with loving and communicating with other Christians.

When we think of countries where Christianity is against the law and churches are closed down, we know people are not attending a service every week. Are they wrong for not doing so? Of course not. They get together when they can, with who they can, usually in small groups in houses or where-ever they feel they can meet safely. It may not be more than two or three people and it can be any day of the week.

Jesus said where two or three gather together in my name, there I am in their midst. We do not need buildings or large groups of people to enjoy assembling together, but we do need each other. This can happen meeting at home, meeting for dinner at a restaurant, getting together in a park or any other place or any day the Spirit brings us into fellowship. The important thing is to love God, love one another and be available for our brothers and sisters in Christ to encourage and build them up.

I once heard someone make an interesting comment about a box of Legos. He said Legos can be constantly gathered together, but it only takes shape to represent the desire of its creator when it is assembled. Then it is ready to perform the function it was created for. So is the body of Christ. Therefore, those who put all their eggs in the basket of Sunday church, it is they who have truly forsaken the assembling of themselves together. They are constantly gathering, but never really assembling.

Let me point out that I am not against church or those who attend. My wife and I were part of the weekly service for years, but over the past few years we have found that for us, it makes more sense to be outside the walls of religion and seek meaningful fellowship each day with our brothers and sisters in Christ rather than continue to sit in a pew listening to a select few participate.

Whether in a building or not, whether in a home, restaurant, or wherever the Spirit leads us, as followers of Jesus we are the body of Christ, a priesthood of all believers. Rather than an organized meeting in a defined place, it is a daily lifestyle of loving God and loving one another, and everyone is equally important and active parts of the body.

*******

Michael Donahoe was added as a writer for Done with Religion as his views fit perfectly with those that are shared on this site. He and his wife have been outside the walls of religion for fifteen years. He enjoys writing about his experiences and thoughts, and he wants to encourage others who are going through the religious deconstruction process. He also writes on Substack at https://personalmeanderings.substack.com/

God Must Be Perfectly Good Humanly Speaking Or Not Worth Believing In!

by Mike Edwards

It takes faith to believe God exists since there is no visible evidence, but surely most assume any God worth believing in must be perfectly morally good. Dennis Prager argues according to the contemporaneous ancient Near East Babylonian story, the gods destroyed humanity because humans made so much noise keeping the gods awake. I couldn’t believe in such a God because of my understanding of genuine love required by a loving God.

God must be good intuitively! 

If there is a God, they must be perfectly loving. Many of us left organized religion, not God, because claims about God’s character was contrary to our deepest moral intuitions. It doesn’t make sense why a Creator wouldn’t love the same way we humans believe we were seemingly created by a supposed Creator to love (aka goodness). Even those who try to defend God’s violent ways in the Bible agree, or they wouldn’t attempt to rationalize why a supposed inspired/infallible Book by God reports bad actions contributed to God. We can’t always understand what perfect love is – to help a drug addict or let them hit bottom – but even the Bible assume we can understand God’s perfect love through human lens – “be perfect, as your heavenly God is perfect.” (Mt 5:48).

God can only be understood through “goodness” lens anyway

If God is bad or evil at times, we can only understand such actions by comparing/exploring what is good. If God was supposedly unloving, we can only pursue such knowledge by discussing what true love it. It seems we can only rely on human reasoning what is good or common moral sense whether interpreting a Book, judging one’s actions toward others, or understanding what God’s love is like. We know God’s goodness by assuming not bad! 

How do we know what “good” is? 

Parents create/have children to be loved and teach how to love others. An existing Creator surely creates desiring to love and hopes we love others as parents should love their children. We all seem to know the question we ought to ask ourselves – am I loving others perfectly? Self-evident morals aren’t hidden in any Holy Book. We all have an inborn sense of good and evil. We may not always be certain the most loving action, unless my son or son-in laws mistreat women!  There is a reason anyone who justifies selfishness is often friendless.  

Why do some argue perfect human and Godly love aren’t always the same?

The Bible doesn’t always describe God in perfect human moral terms, so may God-believers resort to suggesting God’s actions are sometimes a mystery. Believers assume God must be perfectly good so rationalizations are made. See 9 Reasons To Not Trust The Bible’s Claims About God! Many assume that the entire Bible is approved/inspired by God, so they must explain why the Bible reports God acting violently or destructively. But a Book can’t be the definitive word about God since subject to different interpretations, and we can’t prove God always controlled what the writers understood and wrote about God.

So What….If God Is Good Or Not? 

Why believe in or desire to have a relationship with a God you can’t respect or attempt to understand? Many may reject or resist God if perceived as authoritative versus nurturing. See here. As stated, many of us left the institutional church because leaders kept insisting characteristics of God, according to the Bible, were contrary to our moral sense. Others inclined to believe in God may hesitate because of what God is described by Christians as supposedly being like. God doesn’t send people to a torturous afterlife for choices made briefly here on earth. The majority of people end up believing in the religion, whether Christian, Buddhist, or Muslim, where born. God isn’t a God of chance! God likely gives all a chance now or after death to believe or not. God is exactly who you imagine a loving God is like – unless you’re a selfish human being.  Then, good luck having genuine friendships!

Mike Edwards was added as a writer and has been a great addition to the site. Mike provides many interesting views and various ways of looking at things. He is not afraid to ask questions and he keeps an open mind as to teachings of the institutional church. Mike also has his own site where he writes at What God May Really Be Like

Yes I Am A Christian….But (My Idea of Being A Christian is Different than You May Think)

by Michael Donahoe

When I say I am a Christian, people usually stereotype me as a Christian that is something different from what I mean.

People tend to equate Christianity with certain beliefs, doctrines and actions. People who are Christian usually believe certain things, participate in certain things or avoid certain things.

Yet, for me, I do not fit into the normal mold of what people think of as Christianity. A few of those things are as follows:

I do not attend church

I do not believe the Bible is the inerrant word of God

I do not believe the world was created in 6 actual days

I do not believe the USA is a Christian nation nor God’s chosen nation

I am not Republican (nor a Democrat)

I do not claim to be evangelical. I really do not even like using the term Christian because of the negative thoughts it creates

I love and accept people, all people, male, female, black, white, Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Jewish, Atheist, LGBTQ. I believe Jesus said to love God and love one another. I believe we all are created in the image of God.

I am patriotic, but not nationalistic. America is not a Christian nation nor is it God’s chosen nation. It is not OK to force religious beliefs on everyone. We are free to choose for ourselves what we believe and who we follow.

I do believe in science

I do believe the Spirit of God lives within us and we are guided by the Spirit not a book

I do believe in the freedom of choice for all people in all matters. We cannot legislate morality nor a particular version of faith.

I believe that my spiritual life and secular life are not separate but intertwined. We are not spiritual one day but secular another. Living each day is a combination of being spiritual and secular.

There are many other topics in regard to traditional Christianity I could cover, but you get the idea. When people hear the word Christian, all sorts or stereotypical ideas come to their thoughts. The main point to think about is based on a Bible verse, by their fruits you shall know them.

Rather than automatically think all Christians are the same, wait a while and watch how they act and treat others. It will be clear soon if they are loving, kind, inclusive and accepting; or if they are judgmental, condemning, exclusive and force their faith on others.

The bottom line is, we all have some type of faith. If my faith does not lead me to love, help, encourage and allow others the freedom to have their own views and faith, then I need to keep my opinion and faith to myself.

Rather than forcing my way of faith on others, my goal is to be Christ-like day by day by being loving, joyful, peaceful, patient, kind, good and faithful. Forcing your faith on others, judging and condemning those who have a different kind of faith or a different view and opinion is not loving and certainly not Christ-like.

*******

Michael Donahoe was added as a writer for Done with Religion as his views fit perfectly with those that are shared on this site. He and his wife have been outside the walls of religion for fifteen years. He enjoys writing about his experiences and thoughts, and he wants to encourage others who are going through the religious deconstruction process. He also writes on Substack at https://personalmeanderings.substack.com/

What is One Main Way To Discern Who May Be Telling The Truth?

by Mike Edwards

We can’t know for sure who is telling the truth when opinions exist on both sides of either religious or political debates. We have to make up our own mind. I admit I don’t always know who is telling the truth, so I am going to answer what trait pisses me off the most. By the way, if you think there is only one rational viewpoint on matters dividing us, please reconsider. I consider it irrational if one refuses to consider an opinion contrary to their own. In religion we have to decide whose view of God to believe – does God condemn gays or not. In politics we have to decide who to believe on matters such as immigration or climate change. Even in science, should we wear masks or not. Afterall, everyone who wore a mask ended up getting Covid. I wrote here several reasons how one might discern who may be more on the side of truth than others.

Question or doubt those that refuse investigation or debate 

One main reason to not trust one’s opinion when they refuse discussion or investigation. Dr. Fauci claimed rejecting him is rejecting science. But science is questioning science (i.e. some drugs approved initially are taken off the market). Religious leaders who claim their views are God’s Word and don’t invite debate – are they afraid to defend their views in public so individuals can decide for themselves and possibly disagree. Theologians who hide behind the Bible (“God said,”) are claiming to be holier than those than disagree with them. When voter fraud is claimed why refuse investigations unless hiding something? Politicians who don’t invite debate – don’t trust them further than you can throw them. Run from those who claim certainty and don’t try to defend their opinions. Why don’t they seek to defend the supposed truth to convince others?

Claiming certainty is a way to avoid investigation 

We must avoid claiming our truth is certain if not universal agreement. Who doesn’t think rape or incest is evil? Adultery isn’t only wrong in the eyes of the betrayer. Assume uncertainty if you have one rational friend who believes differently from you whether it’s about religion or politics. Couples who claim certainty when differences arise are headed toward divorce or a sucky relationship. God-followers and religious leaders seem hell-bent in telling people what they must believe about God according to their understanding and interpretation of the Bible. Politicians who refuse debate of their policies are no different. Religious or political leaders play God (Superior) in the lives of others by claiming to know the truth and we can’t decide for ourselves.

Censorship is a way to avoid investigation 

Free speech is necessary to allow the battle of ideas when certainty doesn’t exist. A preacher can’t claim God condemns gays because the Bible says so. Many of us don’t believe the Bible says any such thing. See here. Most of us believe except true racists that all humans are created equal, not that one’s skin color determines superiority. Yes, the KKK is allowed to state their hate speech on public platforms. I like my chances of winning that argument in the free market of ideas.  I enjoy racists being exposed for their ideas. The only free speech that should be censored is that which encourages others to commit violence toward others. You must peacefully protest without blocking the rights of others to go where they want. You can’t say “any Jew you see should be killed.”

We don’t always know what is truth, so it is important how we openly purse truth 

• If only religious leaders didn’t always claim their biblical interpretation is correct and at least acknowledge literature requires interpretation despite supposed divine intervention. What are religious leaders afraid of if they have the truth?
• If only we listened to everyone’s opinion civilly and sought to discern together what was the most loving action for the greatest good. It’s complicated!
• If only we closely guarded one’s freedom to choose when the possibility exist you could be wrong, rather than calling others heretics or conspiracists.

If God Changes His Mind, Should We Reconsider What We Think The Bible Guides?

by Mike Edwards

This Post was inspired by a light reading of  The Widening Of God’s Mercy – Sexuality Within The Bible Story  God in the Bible condemns gays, but the father/son scholars don’t tackle the verses claimed to teach that God condemns gays. See here.   The Hays imply even if God supposedly does condemn gays and that is the correct interpretation – God can change his mind to feel differently after what is recorded in the Bible. So, even if you believe the Bible teaches God condemns gays, that may not be God’s attitude today toward gays. Many believe the Bible suggests the husband is the leader of the wife which I  doubt  but anyway, God may change his mind in many circumstances. Since the Bible is used as a rule book in many situations, let’s use the Bible to suggest God can change his mind.

God changes their mind in biblical times, so how about now? 

• “And the Lord regretted that he had made Saul king over Israel.” [I Sam 15:35)
• “And the Lord was sorry that he had made humankind on the earth, and it grieved him to his heart.” (Gen 6:6-7)
• Many know the story of Moses getting God to compromise concerning sparing the disobedient. (Ex 32). When might God compromise with us today what we think the Bible claims in our situation? 

Even God’s laws given are updated and changed 

• “I gave them statutes that were not good and ordinances by which they could not live.” (Ezek 20:25)
• Ex 21:23-25 says “eye for eye” but Jesus updated (Matt 5:39)
• Jesus changed the law regarding the Sabbath (Mk 2:27)
• Exodus 20:24 allows sacrifice on any altar but that then changed to only one location (Deut 12:13-14). (p.55) 

I don’t wish to suggest the Bible should be used as a rule/guide book what to do in your situation since interpretations are infallible, but even in the same culture and times biblical laws were updated depending upon circumstances. What you think the Bible commands you to do, might God sit down and discuss? I know this Post can be used to justify anyone’s evil behavior, but if you think God changes his mind on sexual abuse, think again! 

How does the Bible guide us today?

I think Karl Barth is right: the theologian shouldn’t ask “What the apostles and prophets said, but what we must say on the basis of the apostles and prophets.” (p 4). This supports the idea that even in biblical times God changed his mind and updated laws. Even if you believe the Bible’s writers were never wrong what God thought and that God condemns gays, please consider what God may say today in your relationships with gays, your partner, etc. You may believe the Bible commands capital punishment, but is that what God thinks today in your situation and what you claim about God to others? Using the Bible as a rule book is complicated.

Mike Edwards was added as a writer and has been a great addition to the site. Mike provides many interesting views and various ways of looking at things. He is not afraid to ask questions and he keeps an open mind as to teachings of the institutional church. Mike also has his own site where he writes at What God May Really Be Like

Does God Really Punish Or We Just Reap What We Sow?

by Mike Edwards

Our view of God can depend on how we view God’s role in punishment after wrongdoing. Many portray God as angry and implying God may delight in punishment, yet such punishment seems arbitrary because in reality it seems God lets a lot of evil slide and maybe not your own. One’s motive to push God’s punishment may be to deter evil, but the truth is fear doesn’t lead to life transformations. So says many parents. One must assume God can control everything that happens in the world, if God is in control of punishment. Such a view makes a mockery of freedom. I have a hunch we often just reap what we sow. It is true some sow a lot of evil and reap very little!

Old Testament and punishment

The Flood is probably the grandparent of all stories about God actively punishes. Whether God actually killed most of the human race via a global flood is debatable. Keep in mind ancient literature predating Genesis wrote about local floods in their lands. It is not fabrication if biblical writers used a local flood to illustrate global human problems, as a common literary practice in Ancient Near East times. God isn’t nearly as active in punishing in the New Testament as in the Old Testament. One explanation is that OT writers believed, thus wrote, it was sacrilegious to not express God(s) as all powerful and controlling. This could account for such vast differences in the Old and New Testament accounts of God’s actions.

Biblical example that we simply reap what we sow 

Even the Bible suggests in certain passages sin had its own’s punishment/negative consequences, not that God is going around killing people or choosing when to punish or reward people “Therefore, God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts ….” (Rom 1:24). People sacrificed Jesus on the Cross and weren’t individually punished. The reward for many believing in Jesus was martyrdom.

God’s love is not arbitrary 

No one thinks a loving God plays favorites. If God does actively punish and carry out wrath, God is letting a whole lot of evil in the world slide. God doesn’t love those spared more than those supposedly punished. It is reasonable to believe that consequences for actions serve as punishment and some are more fortunate than others to not suffer for natural consequences of their actions. God isn’t in control of all punishments and looking to pour on at times. I have written here  that God can’t be all-powerful or controlling and be true to God’s nature. Even the Bible claims love does not insist on its own way. (I Cor 13:5) 

How does God view wrongdoing?

One way to understand God’s love is to compare to human love. We all sense what perfect parental love is, even if we did not always experience it. God surely treats rebellion how we think loving, perfect friends or parents of older children ought to respond to wrongdoing. We hate what sin is doing but we don’t seek to pile on. Loving parents try to not personalize their child’s actions. We warn and don’t interfere with consequences. We hope for change before it is too late. God’s love, mercy, and encouragement, not God’s need for punishment, leads to becoming the person we desire to be. God is always empowering and inspiring all to help others. We also don’t have to view an uncontrolling God as not caring and not punishing those who seem to get away with evil, while supposedly not overlooking our own wrongdoing.

Mike Edwards was added as a writer and has been a great addition to the site. Mike provides many interesting views and various ways of looking at things. He is not afraid to ask questions and keeps an open mind as to teachings of the institutional church. He also has his own site where he writes at What God May Really Be Like If you wish to discuss anything I have written, you can email me at medwar2@gmail.com

What Actually is the Bible

by Michael Donahoe

In the gospel of John, it is written ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God’. And further in that gospel is states ‘the Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us’.

To me, this says that when we speak of the Word of God, although many people assume we are talking about the Bible, we are actually talking about Jesus, the Living Word.

So many of us focus on the written word and which version is the true word of God. Yet the verses in John state that the true Word is not a book, but is Jesus who is alive and living within us through the Holy Spirit.

If we were never able to read from the Bible or hear it read to us, we still have the Living Word of God within us to teach us and guide us.

We can learn and be encouraged when we read the Bible no matter which translation we prefer, but we need to remember that the Bible was written by many men over many years. The living Word of God is Jesus who lives within each of us through the Spirit.

We can read the words on the pages of the Bible, but it is only by the Living Word within us that gives life and power to the words we read.

*******

Michael Donahoe was added as a writer as his views fit perfectly with those of Done with Religion. He also writes on Substack at https://personalmeanderings.substack.com/

What About Miracles, Prophesies? – Book Review “Impossible Love”

by Mike Edwards

(I had a tumor removed from my brain 4/21/25. Please excuse mispellings/mistypes. Not sure brain all there)

I dare you to read Impossible Love  and not be awed – a true story of a couple concerning an African Civil War, Miracles, and Hope Against All Odds. It is the first book in a while I couldn’t put down. I do not wish to be critical of scholar Craig Keener and his wife Medine, who is a scholar in her own right. They are an amazing spiritual couple.  I can’t carry their water. Google Craig to see all the scholarly books he has written, which are often the main Seminary text on the topic covered. Many of his books have influenced my views. After I read, I wondered if many may question their level of faith if not believing in prophecies and miracles as this couple does.  Now, the Keener’s don’t claim when mentally hearing God’s voice that they are always right. But does God know the future to advise us ahead of time, and can we expect miracles if we pray enough?

 Is the Bible really inspired? 

I sense the Keeners’ believe God inspired the entire Bible, meaning God controlled and approved all written down. We can’t prove the writers always understood God perfectly. I have written here it is difficult to prove God controlled what written down. It matters because few acknowledge their interpretation may be wrong, so gays are often condemned, women’s leadership roles are limited despite their gifts, and it is suggested a fiery torturous afterlife awaits infidels – all in God’s name. I interpret differently. I believe best to assume God didn’t inspired the Bible, so we feel free to question interpretations that contradict common moral sense. Why would God create us to have moral intuitions contrary to God’s?

Did God really ordered Israel to commit hundreds of atrocities in the OT – “… put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys” (I Sam. 15:3).  Such genocidal behavior makes no human moral sense. God’s possible justification of violence can lead to imitation of violent solutions such as capital punishment, blowing up abortion clinics, or unnecessary wars in the name of God. It matters your view of the Bible and if inspired by God! 

Is prophesy in the Bible God knowing the future? 

I have written here why God can’t know the future, thus prophecies in the Bible or now can’t possibly know the future. It is natural to think an all-knowing, powerful God knows future outcomes. But to assume God knows the future suggests a predetermined future which makes freedom nonsensical. Another view is that God joins us relationally in a free, unknown future concerning our decisions. God isn’t hiding the future from us. When one assumes prophesy is God knowing the future, one may wonder why God doesn’t warn us all of upcoming tradegy? See Does Prophecy In The Bible Really Predict The Future?

 The Keeners’ don’t seem to suggest their dreams or prophecies they share are definitive. I think their beliefs in an inspired Bible and their interpretations is influential. I am not convinced prophecies from God about the future can be distinguished from mental impressions we may have.

Why does it matter! 

In reading the Keener’s experience, one may think they should expect to hear from God who they should marry. Such a belief can led to inaction or choosing the wrong partner. I don’t believe God has one partner in mind for anyone, or that you should wait to hear from God before making a decision. God gave you a brain and God can’t tell you if your future partner will be faithful or may betray you. Make decisions based on the wisest path at the time based on current partner’s actions and conjoint future aspirations. God will be there with you in such decisions and future challenges. These concerns are relational important with God Read the book for more discussion on the topic.

Why is it important whether God knows the future or not? 

A known or set future suggests one isn’t truly free to choose otherwise. God may know all possibilities, but the future must be open if we are truly free. To the contrary, God’s will isn’t some hidden plan to discover that God keeps from us. God can’t tell you if the person you want to marry won’t end up betraying you or the job you take won’t end up being phased out. We surely have God’s blessing choosing the wisest path known at the time based on past experiences, current circumstances, and future aspirations. God joins us in considering risks to change the world for better. God’s moral ways are not mysterious or hidden. God seeks only to influence us to do all the good, rather than evil, that we can in all the places we can, at all the times we can, to all the people we can, as long as we can. Jesus prayed God’s will be done on earth as in heaven (Mt. 6:10). God’s plan is not a detailed blueprint but a general one to set us free to love.

What Is God’s Plan For Your Life?

How Do We Discover God’s Will For Our Life?

 Do miracles happen

I am not one to believe in miracles mostly because I haven’t experienced or seen such events. But I also don’t think the Bible is totally made up reporting miracles. Also, one cannot deny Craig Keener’s scholarship on miracles as reliable reports exists all over the world. I am not going to try to convince you either way. I don’t know! But I think it is important to consider personally if miracles are possible or not. Most of us have asked God for a miracle in our life, even unbelievers. Most would admit the answer usually has been “no.” Did we not pray enough? Are we not faithful enough as the Keener’s or other individuals who reports miracles?

One has ever right to ask why doesn’t God intervene more than God does. I prefer to assume God always desires to intervene miraculously. One possible better explanation for miracles is that various biological factors are involved such as cells and organs. If God doesn’t deny human freedom, it may not be a stretch to say God has to account for natural freedom as well when it comes to miracles in nature. Perhaps miracles can happen when God’s uncontrolling love aligns with countless factors known and not known. God cannot intervene singlehandedly, but a loving God is dying to intervene miraculously by all means whenever circumstances will allow. I am not sure the Keener’s would agree. It is important to understand why God may not be able to answer.

This post is about your relationship with God!

Don’t assume that all of the Bible is inspired by God. Don’t condemn your child, who says they are gay, because of your interpretation of a supposed inspired Bible. Don’t assume God knows the future? Maybe God didn’t know your spouse would betray you. Maybe God grieves with you because God can’t control freedom, etc? Your understanding of God and God’s power in a world of freedom matters in your relationship! My understanding of God empowers my relationships with God and others I seek to treat like I want to be treated.

*******

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also writes on his own site that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

The Word of God

by Jim Gordon

When we hear someone talk about the Word of God, we immediately think of the Bible. I believed this for many years while growing up in church and being part of the institutional church.

As I started my religious deconstruction, I paid more attention to the words written in the book of John, ‘In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God’. Following that, there was this, ‘And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us; and we saw His glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth’.

Obviously, this made me question the idea that the Bible was the word of God when the Bible itself was saying that Jesus is the Word of God.

So many of us focus on the Bible, almost making it part of the trinity. But, it is not the Father, Son and Holy Bible. We also focus on what version of the Bible is the true word of God. These verses state that Jesus is the true Word and is alive and living within us by the Spirit.

If we were never again able to read from the Bible or hear it read to us, we still have the Living Word of God within us to teach us and guide us. We are also told that ‘the anointing which you received from Him remains in you, and you have no need for anyone to teach you; but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you remain in Him’.

When we read our Bibles, no matter what translation we prefer, we can be sure that the Spirit who lives within us brings those words to life, teaches us what God has for us and gives power to those words. Apart from that, the Bible is just a book that teaches us about what others thought about God. But the important part is that it leads us to Jesus who is the living Word of God.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

Should We Assume The Bible Isn’t Inspired By God And Does It Matter? – All Rants Against The Bible Here

By Mike Edwards

If you read my weekly Post you are probably tired of my harping on the Bible. The word Bible has occurred over a 100 times in the title of my Post in the past decade or so.  See here.  This Post is an attempt to say all I feel needed about the topic of inspiration and the Bible. Honestly, I sometimes share some of the same content, just change the Post title to look at the topic asking a different question.

Many hearing claims that God inspired the Bible assume all characterizations in the Bible about God are true. They assume inspiration means God approved all recorded by the writers. They don’t think of inspiration as meaning that God encouraged or motivated writers/editors to record their understanding of God, thus possible being right or wrong.  I felt inspired to write this Post about God. That doesn’t mean all I claim about God is necessarily true.

It is important to realize that we can’t prove the Bible is or isn’t inspired by God. Besides, the Bible is literature that requires interpretation and we don’t all agree on the correct interpretation even concerning moral issues such as if God condemns gays or not. There are moral reasons to assume the Bible is not inspired. One then may ask how can we know God if not through the Bible, and others concerns such as how to read the Bible, whether to tell children bible stories, etc.

Can we prove the Bible is inspired by God or not? 

Can We Prove The Bible Is Inspired By God?

Even if we could prove God inspired every word in the Bible (God controlling the writers always accurately portrayed God), the Bible requires interpretation and such interpretations could be right or wrong

What Is Main Reason We Should Question if God Inspired The Bible?

Is The Bible Really The Word Of God

There are many important moral reasons to assume the Bible isn’t inspired by God 

Why Is It Important To Consider Bible Not Inspired?

 9 Reasons To Not Trust The Bible’s Claims About God!

How The Bible And The Quran Can Be Dangerous!

 How can we understand God if not through an inspired Holy Book?

 Do We Understand God Through The Bible or Common Moral Sense?

 Questions that may arise if questioning the inspiration of the Bible?

Are Biblical Stories Helpful Or Harmful To Children?

 Why Is One Defensive If Suggested The Bible May Have Errors?

 How Cn We Make Reading The Bible Less Difficult And More Enjoyable?

 Can We Stop Saying Our Nation Needs To Get Back To Biblical Truths?

 Can I Follow God If I Can’t Stand Reading The Bible?

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

Healing Divisions within the Body of Christ

by Michael Donahoe

When I think about the institutional church world today, I am disturbed that it is divided into so many different groups and denominations. We will all have a little different interpretation of the Bible, a little different understanding of doctrine and we will not agree on everything. Yet, we certainly should be able to love one another and accept each other even when we differ on these things. Afterall, we are all following the example of Jesus and we all love God.

It is hard to understand why this happens when God tells us we are to be one as Jesus and God are one. We have to understand that we are human and it is easy to lose sight of our first love. If we could only stay focused on Christ, listening for the guidance of the Spirit, loving God and loving others we could look past our differences and love one another with a godly love.

The problem seems to be that we are unwilling to see any other viewpoint other than our own. There are those such as my wife and I that do not attend an organized church. There are those who attend a church every time the doors are open. Some attend a house church, some meet with fellow believers at cafe’s, parks or restaurants and others meet in their homes over dinner. We should accept these differences and love one another rather than argue over who is right and who is wrong.

There really is not a right or wrong way to assemble together and we need to stop expecting everyone to do things exactly the same way. We should respect others viewpoints and focus on loving them rather than expecting them to see things our way.

Things will not change until we start focusing on what is common in our lives rather than the differences. The common focus should be on Christ, the head of the body. After that, we should focus on loving others rather than arguing about the differences in interpretation.

We also should keep in mind that we are all constantly changing as God brings new truth to us. We are all learning and changing as we are ready to accept new truths. The opinions I had ten years ago are completely different from some of the views I have now. I am sure in another five or ten years they will change again as the Spirit leads me into more truth.

Sometimes we are afraid to accept others interpretations because we feel if we do not hold to our way of thinking, we are compromising and not standing up for what we believe. We do not have to give up how we interpret the Bible or whether we attend church or not, but neither should we think everyone else is wrong. Besides, we really are not responsible for convicting people of sin, leading them into truth or even saving them. That is the job of the Holy Spirit. We are told to love God and love others.

When we realize we are each equally important functioning parts of the body, and Christ is the head, we can start to change how we feel about those who do not see things the way we do. We can begin to accept our brothers and sisters in Christ just as they are, realizing we are walking as one with God even in our differences.

*******

Michael Donahoe was added as a writer as his views fit perfectly with those of Done with Religion. He also writes on Substack at https://personalmeanderings.substack.com/